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Kevn Kinney has been the frontman of Drivin N Cryin for nearly 40 years now. He’s worked on side projects and solo albums and even his own podcast, Free Parking. But even long after the days of Drivin N Cryin music getting play on college radio, drawing crowds in both Atlanta and Athens, Georgia, the band continues to write and record great music. Their latest album, Crushing Flowers is a testament to why Kevn is known as a songwriter’s songwriter and a fantastic storyteller. Stay tuned for my talk with Kevn Kinney. 

DJ: Well, Kevn Kinney, how are you?

Kevn: I’m doing well. How are you?

DJ: Oh, good. And thank you so much for doing this

Oh, you’re originally from Milwaukee, Wisconsin, right?

Kevn: Proudly. Yes, I am.

Well, my grandfather’s from St. Louis and, and my mother, grandmother’s from Cahokia and Belleville.

DJ: Oh, wow. That’s

Kevn: and so I, and then my, they moved to Milwaukee when my dad was like in his teens, as a teenager.

DJ: Huh.

Kevn: So yes, so I had family in both, places. 

.

DJ: Well, if all goes as planned, I’ll be up in Wisconsin this fall. A friend of mine lives in, uh, Madison. He was in Middleton, now he’s in Madison, and I keep telling him I’m gonna come up and see him, but, uh, we’ll make that happen.

Not too far from Milwaukee. back up, do you ever get back up there? 

Kevn: I go up there pretty often. Yeah, it’s a very, um, you know, Madison and Milwaukee, when I was a kid I used to take the bus to Madison just to go look at the bookstores and have a gyro, which I thought was called gyro back then

‘cause I, no one had really told me. and so, uh, but, and I think it would cost, you know, [00:01:00]$4.75 I think, something like that, right?

So it’s very close

DJ: So I’m curious what your early life in Wisconsin was like. I think you and I grew up, you know, in the same era of, like, grade school in the ‘60s, high school in the ‘70s. What was, what was life in Milwaukee like for you in those days?

Kevn: Oh, well, you know, you know, my childhood was, you know, I guess most of us that grew up in the ‘60s were, You have a couple more years of, of sunshine before I did. I was, I grew up in ‘61. You know, I mean, I wasn’t, of course I wasn’t aware of the assassination of, of President Kennedy.

But I was aware of the, I was aware of the assassination of, Martin Luther King and, uh, Robert Kennedy. And, you know, I mean, I think that we have a bit of denial because it was only dawning on, on me now you know, through self, realization therapy that I’m giving myself. ’cause, you know, Drivin N Cryin is one of the world’s greatest, quasi-political self-help, quasi garage rock, uh, se- like [00:02:00]hard rock folk bands.

But, uh, but I really lived in a whole era of war. Like, I remember war being just war. It was war. Like, I didn’t get that 19- Like, people born in the ‘50s had a little bit of like, little bit of, of go-getum, like, uh, Western, Westerns and, and, uh, wacky things. But my whole thing was like really heavy.

And so, you know, growing up in Milwaukee, I was, I remember the day that I was outside my house and I heard a band playing in a park. Like, I heard a drum set and I didn’t know what it was. It was like, there’s something happening. So I rode my bike up to this swimming pool that was like five blocks away, and there’s a band playing.

And I was like, I was like, “Oh my God, this is unbelievable. What is, what is this?” Like, I, he was, I had never seen this live, and it was really great. you know, that was, you know. But I was really drawn to popular pop music, like The Archies and all the [00:03:00] bubblegum music, The Ohio Express and the Kasenetz-Katz Orchestral Circus, and all these flowery, shiny, fun things because I needed balance in my life from this like daily body count that CBS was giving us every night.

And it was like really intense. So Milwaukee was a working class place that went from a booming 1940s, thir- 20s, 30s, 50s, little bit in the 60s industrial thing, to being the land of things that used to be. Everybody left in the ‘70s. Even the beer companies left. So it was like growing up in this weird like kind of ghost town, you know? So it’s kind of, you know, it’s, uh, it’s been a c- you know, I have a love-hate relationship with it, you know? it’s a tough place to grow up, I ain’t gonna lie to you

DJ: Yeah. Well, in those days, was guitar the first instrument you learned, or how, how early did you start learning to play an instrument?

Kevn: A guitar, absolutely, yeah. I bought a guitar. I think w- I think I was a traditional bought a guitar when I was 16 kinda kid, you know? I think I was [00:04:00] like, got my first amp and my first guitar when I was 16, and I had a band, uh, called Breakdown, ‘ cause we loved Breakdown by Tom Petty. But we didn’t know how to play it, so we just played Iron Man. Uh, we had, we had the Christmas lights in the garage and, uh, we just, I just loved remembering, like, going to practice, okay? I don’t know, we never did a gig, but we would get together and we would just, like I say, we would play Iron Man. I think we learned Doctor Love by Kiss, uh, ‘cause there was a lot of time between chord changes.

Like, uh, duh, duh. I was like, “We can do that one.” From my, from my Rock and Roll Over easy guitar book. Uh, yeah, but guitar is hard. It’s a hard instrument to learn, and I, I’m just now learning how to play it.

DJ: Especially when you’re figuring out that, “Hey, I should probably invest in some lighter gauge strings”. I’ve got these really, really…

Kevn: Right. Well, I wish somebody had told me about this thing called a capo a long [00:05:00] time ago, ‘cause I would’ve, it, it makes it a lot easier to play. Anybody listening out there that has a guitar that they don’t, that has the ex- the strings are too hard to push down on, it’s called action, just buy a capo, go to your local, and put it on the second fret and everything’s gonna be a lot easier

DJ: Exactly Well, um, you, while you’re still living in Wisconsin, you’re, you know, for a pretty good chunk of your life, did you form any bands while you were there, or was that mainly after your move to Atlanta?

Kevn: No, I did. I had a punk rock band called The, The Prosecutors, uh, with my friend Doug Lavallière, and we were both roadies for this band called The Haskels and The Oil Tasters. The Oil Tasters were on Thermidor Records, uh, Jello Biafra’s label. And, um, The Haskels were, like, the really, really, like, super popular Milwaukee punk band, punk new wave band.

and so, I would, um, roadie, I roadied for them. I was their roadie. And I had an underground newspaper that I had started as well. I wanted to be a rock writer. So I, I ... [00:06:00] Me and my friend Dave Luhrssen, who worked for, that still works for, I think, the Milwaukee Journal. we started an underground paper called Express, which became the Shepherd Express, which has been around still in Milwaukee for quite a while.

And I, I didn’t have much to do with it. As, you know, as I went to journalism school, you know, uh, in summer, summer school, and I just really wanted to be a writer. But then rock and roll kind of pulled me into a different direction where you had to ... Writing was, writing’s hard, you know, to keep your train of thought going.

So I really loved watching the band. When w- when we, the, when I was a roadie, I would go sit in and watch bands rehearse, you know? My friend Clancy Carroll had a band in the ‘70s. I would watch Brian Ritchie from the Violent Femmes. You know, me and Brian were, we went to high school together, and B- Brian, I used to watch Brian play guitar.

He played, like, his c- his power chords, and he had this really cool band. He always had a bunch of bands. He played with Plastic Land and- And so I, I would just follow him around and go watch him rehearse, you know? he was, like, [00:07:00] my big ... He was a couple years older than me, so he was a, but he could really play guitar and, and the, and the bass and all that.

Yeah, but I knew him mainly as a guitar player, I think. But, um, yeah. So, yeah, that was my first band called The Prosecutors. We made one 45 called The Prosecution Rests, and, uh, it was pretty good. And yeah

DJ: And did I read somewhere that at one point you were working at a futon company, like working at the futon company in the day and playing music at night?

Kevn: Well, that’s in Atlanta. In Milwaukee, I worked for Peaches.

DJ: Oh, you worked at a Peaches. Oh, wow

Kevn: I worked, I was a 45 buyer at Peaches and then, and then I worked at, and then I got, and then I got to work for this place called Radio Doctors, which was the number one, one-stop in the Midwest. And so we would get, you know, we would fill orders from 1,000 records for record stores to two records for, like, a barber shop in Des Moines or, or, or, you know, uh, Cahokia.

You know, just, you know, some soda shop that wanted one record, you know? So we, we were a, [00:08:00] a one-stop. We were a, a distributor and we ha- and we had a record store upstairs, so, and it’d been there since the ‘30s, I think. So it was a really great place to get my musical education. Between, between the being a roadie and seeing how songs are written and being, uh, working at, uh, working at the record store and working for Billboard, you know, I, I, I did inventory for Billboard.

And so just learning how everything works, you know, uh, was really great. And then I, I kind of, I kinda quit my band and I quit Milwaukee and I moved down south and I was just a construction worker. I built sewage plants. And then I met a guy who was, like, lived down the street, and he started making me demos.

So I made, I used, I was making demos with him while I was wor- doing construction. And as it, I did two years of hard labor, and then he owned a futon shop, so I wa- I, I eventually wound up working at the futon shop for him,

DJ: So that’s where the futon shop was.[00:09:00]

Kevn: I came in, yeah, yeah, it was like, yeah. But yeah, there was a, there was a band called Die Kreuzen.

I don’t know if you remember them, but they were a hard rock hardcore band out of Milwaukee. And when they would come visit me in Atlanta, I would put them up and we would hang out with them and, and they’d make their T-shirts and we’d, you know, just... They, they were like an, an actual w- first band I knew besides the Violent Femmes that were a national touring act.

You know, they played San Francisco and they played New York and they played LA, like, all the, every year, twice a year. They would travel in this van, and it was just really inspiring to see all these things before I ever started, like, a proper band. You know, Drivin N Cryin was, I’ll consider a proper band.

I had all this information building up about how to do this and how I wanted it to be done and what I wanted to do, so-

DJ: It, it came to fruition. 

Kevn: It came to fruition. Yes, don’t ask, be careful what you ask for.

DJ: The band Drivin N Cryin came from one of your song titles, right?

Kevn: Yeah, that was from my punk rock band. We had a, that one of our [00:10:00] songs was Drivin N Cryin. So, that’s where this, uh, that was on my first demo that I made. And so that we’re, my friend Frank French, who made the, who was, recorded the, he recorded the record. He was in a band with a guy called Brendan O’Brien at the same time, who wound up producing, you know, Black Crowes, Pearl Jam, Springsteen, all these other people.

we’re all kind of in the same little world over here. yeah, Frank was in the 1910 Fruitgum Company too,

DJ: Oh, 

Kevn: just like a really crazy, crazy world. Yeah

DJ: Huh. Well, you guys gained quite a following in Atlanta. And in those days, like, what, what kinds of clubs and venues were you playing once Drivin N Cryin was getting out?

Kevn: Uh, well, there was a, our, we had like a CBGB’s here called 688, which is like where every band played, every touring band played, and they were like, they were like that go-to, punk rock club, uh, you know, the, the, the Cat’s Cradle in, in Chapel Hill and, you know, like the, um, like in Chicago you had the Metro [00:11:00] or you had the Schuba’s or, you know, all those kind of places.

St. Louis had like Off-Broadway. We played there. Um, uh, I don’t know where else we played. We played in St. Louis, um, in the old days. Uh, we played Down, we played Mississippi Nights was when we got bigger. We opened for Living Colour there. And, uh, yeah, you know, we used to play, and we used to play the Bluebird in, uh, is that what it’s called?

The Bluebird in Columbia, South Carolina, or

DJ: The Blue Note. The Blue Note, yeah.

Kevn: The Blue Note. We played there and when it was next door to this place called Liquor, Guns and Ammo, you know? 

DJ: There’s a classic photo of, uh, the Morells, you know, standing out front of that Liquor, Guns and Ammo sign down in Columbia

Kevn: Well, a good friend of mine, do you know who Nicky Sudden is from the ... There, there’s a guy we, me and Peter Buck did a tour called, uh, MacDougal Blues Tour, and, uh, and Nicky, we picked up Nicky Sudden in Hoboken, and he was in this band called The Swell Maps. And Nicky was a [00:12:00]great songwriter and singer, and just a really great guy.

Very English, very, uh, Oscar Wilde. And he wrote a song. I took him to Columbia. Me and Peter and Nicky played Columbia, and we did Liquor, Guns and Ammo. He wrote that song. He wrote a song called Liquor, Guns and Ammo. So,

DJ: Well, you mentioned, uh, 688. Wasn’t that the l- label for your, the very first album, Scarred But Smarter?

Kevn: Yeah, they started a record label And then, in ‘86 I think, we were one of the first, we were their first main album. They had a couple loc- other local acts. they had a compilation they made first, which was like us and The Fleshtones. Fleshtones were the marquee act, ‘cause I don’t even know, they weren’t from Atlanta, but they were huge in Atlanta.

And uh, a couple other acts like Arms Akimbo. yeah, so, uh, a- at the same time was, yeah, they were th- definitely the, uh, you know, like I said, the CBGB of, of Atlanta, you know

DJ: After that first album, then, um, he ended up signing with Island for Whisper Tames the [00:13:00]Lion

Kevn: Yes, which was basically The Golden Palominos. it was produced by Anton Fier.

DJ: Right.

Kevn: We were in New York, and it was kind of our first major label, so we didn’t really blo- We didn’t really have much to say about it. So we kind of did what we were told. But it turned out good. People love it. I like it. but it’s not really what, where we were.

We were like lay-on-the-floor psychedelic hard rock, you know, lots of fog, and then we kind of were like, "Oh, I guess this is what he sees in these songs, so let’s do that." And it’s, it has Bernie Worrell’s on it, and Anton

Fier plays It’s, it’s a really, it’s a, it’s, uh, I think it’s one of, one of, uh, The Golden Palominos best records until I made another one, made another Golden Palomino record with Anton Fier, uh, just in the early 2000s, you know, which is another really great record

DJ: Was that the A Good Country Mile? 

Kevn: Yeah, Tony Scherr, Aaron Lee Tasjan, Anton Fier, Chris Masterson, all sorts of great, uh, Andy Hess is the bass player. It’s really [00:14:00] great. It’s a great... I’m glad I did it. It’s, it’s, you know, I was living in Brooklyn for, 10 years or so.

Kevn: Hey, Y’all, this is Kevn Kinney from Drivin N Cryin, and you’re listening to Frets with DJ Fey.

DJ: Hmm. Well, you’ve over the years. I mean, you’ve worked on various side projects and solo albums, but, um, Drivin N Cryin has always remained. I’m curious about one particular period of time basically for all of us, and that’s the pandemic days. I mean, this podcast, my podcast, was born out of the lockdown days.

I, I was just, I was going crazy from boredom and had been wanting to do a show featuring musicians who played guitar. Just had this wacky idea, and I think ... Well, I think during that period you were working on painting. Were you doing some paintings during that period?

Kevn: Yeah, I did about 20 paintings or so in my attic. I was doing my podcast. I did this thing called, uh, on Fridays, I think it was Fridays, or maybe it was Wednesdays. No, I think it’s Fridays, called Free Parking.

DJ: Yeah, Free Parking.

Kevn: And, and so I did Free Parking, and I’m gonna go back to doing that, after, like, in the fall I think [00:15:00] I’m gonna start doing that again.

And, um, now that I have my computer set up finally. And the- I was doing that over a, like a 2012 computer that didn’t even have ethernet or anything. It was like, it was amazing that it worked at all. But I really loved doing it and staying in touch with people. We had just recorded this record called Live the Love Beautiful though, so that was kinda hard to tour on and, you know, it’s kinda, uh, ‘cause I think it came out in 2019, I think.

I can’t remember. But it was, yeah, it was a lot, you know? It was really hard, when the world shut down, and just losing gigs, like, all those gigs, like, it just, I couldn’t believe it, you know?

DJ: Yeah, in early episodes of, of Frets, the subject came up quite a bit about how musicians were, were dealing with the situation, either recording remotely and sharing files or doing home videos of songs and sharing them online. So it was a crazy period

Kevn: It really was, it was a, well, it was a good way to figure out who you were and what you were and why you were doing it, and if you really needed to be doing this. Um, [00:16:00] you know, it kinda took me a minute to get back into wanting to do live performances anyway

I’m not a live performing entertainer. Like, I don’t, I’m not dying to... I, I will go present these songs that I wrote, but I’m not really there to, like, to dance or anything. I’m not really, you know, that guy. But, um, I really loved doing the paintings because they were all just all based on songs.

So I kinda did, like, know, I used to go hang out with Howard Finster and stuff and watch Howard work, and he’d write his, all of his little things. So I just wanted to do a bunch of paintings that were, like, very colorful, and were, like, you know, well, I have five granddaughters, and so I spend a lot of time shopping for children’s books at Goodwill ‘cause they’re incredibly cheaper than the children books are very expensive.

and so I love the l- very bright colors and they’re not great works of art. - It’s outsider outsider art. Yeah. So, yes.

DJ: I loved Howard Finster’s art I did see, you know, some of the originals at galleries. I really wish I could have gone and seen them in their, in their context, but, uh, he was [00:17:00] something else

Kevn: He was an interesting fellow. Yeah. He didn’t have to, you only had to ask him one question and then he would go for about an hour. So

DJ: Well, several decades in now, I think close to 40 years, the Drivin N Cryin story continues, and you have a new album out, and I want to talk about some of the people who contributed to it. I’ll start with one that makes me sad every time I think about it, and that’s Todd Snider, who provided some vocals

Kevn: Yes

DJ: I saw some memorable Todd Snider shows back in my day.

We mentioned Mississippi Nights, I saw him there back years ago and oh my gosh, every- I think everyone was just like pretty torn up to hear that news a few months ago

Kevn: Yes. Well, I mean, me and Todd became friends back in 1990 when I was recording a record called Fly Me Courageous in Memphis, where he lived, and he was recording his first demos in the same studio. And w- I went and saw his show, and we became phone pals and then internet friends.

And, and I would live in his house, you know, for like a summer or a couple weeks at a [00:18:00] time or... You know, we were, we’re- he’s like my little brother. and so he came by the studio to visit, I don’t know, one day, and I was r- recording this song called “Iggy Monkey”. I was doing vocals for this song called “Iggy Monkey”, which is, which is a story about, it’s the, the, you know, the monkeys are all hanging out in their, like, wacky little house, and then, like, all of a sudden Iggy Pop shows up at, like, 2:00 in the morning.

He’s like, “You want wacky? I got wacky.” And so he, like, it’s like Iggy, like, freaking them out a little bit, and then he, like, steals the monkey mobile, and he heads down to Sunset Strip. So this, it was just a fantasy, a cartoon I had, idea in my brain. and I put a little soundtrack to it, which is, you know, what is great about songs is, you know, to be a writer you gotta write all these chapters and all these things.

With music you can just write the outline, and then you add a soundtrack, and you got a song. It’s pretty easy. Um, so Todd stopped in the studio just as I was about to sing the last verse, and I was like, I was get- I was like, “Todd, will you sing the last verse of this for me?” He’s like, “Yeah.” [00:19:00] So he did it.

I was, he, like, he loved the story behind it, so he was really into it. So, so I was glad to have him. and then I lost him, uh, not long after that, yeah, he was a real force of nature. Brilliant songwriter. Never stopped working. he never stopped typing. He never stopped thinking. he was just really, it, it’s, you know, my friendship with him was just really special. We, me and him, uh, me, Elizabeth Cook, Aaron Lee Tasjan, uh, we had a little, and Chuck Mead, uh, we had a little, you know, we used to hang out all together on the porch and write and hang out. It’s, uh, it was, uh, memories, really great memories

DJ: Chuck Mead’s gonna be in town next month at, at Off Broadway, which is still my favorite venue.

Kevn: Oh, yes, he is one of my favorites. Well, please go see him and tell him I say hi, ‘cause he is a genius. He’s, and he’s a very important historical legend, uh, very figure in Nashville. He, you know, he really helped create that whole s- a lot of that scene there. He, he deserves a lot of [00:20:00] credit for all the things you’re hearing on outlaw radio.

You know, the Nashville scene, I mean, Chuck helped freaking create that. So g- everybody should go see him

DJ: Yeah, I had Chuck on the show, I guess it was last year, but, uh, he’s, he’s

Kevn: Oh, yeah, he is one of my favorites

DJ: And Peter Buck is on the new album. He’s appeared on Drivin’ and Cryin’ albums before. He played

Kevn: Absolutely. He’s, he’s produced, he produ- he played on our Mystery Road record, he produced MacDougal Blues, he He played on Wrapped in Sky, I believe, Flying might be the only one he didn’t play on, but yeah, he’s played on a lot of our records. and, uh, he brought out his REM 12-string and played on Crushing Flowers and “Mirror Mirror” on this new record

DJ: “Mirror Mirror” is a song you wrote about your mom and her battle with Alzheimer’s. It’s, it’s a beautiful song and a very beautiful video.

Kevn: Thank you. I wrote it just kind of trying to think of what you do when you’re in, you’re, you know, if you’re alone with, your mom, and she’s your mom, and she you’re, and-- But, you know, she’s, and she’s, she still knows who I am, so that’s great. But it [00:21:00] was just, you know, when you’re sitting there just face to face and you’re just looking at her and I like, I see your eyes and I’m like, “I know you’re in there somewhere” She doesn’t quite know where she is or who she is. Well, she knows who she is. she doesn’t quite know her history or, or where, you know, what’s going on, in the present.

The past is extremely clear to her, which is what I put in the song, like, “Yesterday’s are living, clear and so alive. But maybe you remember me. It’s possible you don’t.” You know? and then I know you’re in this somewhere looking for this song because really bring her to life. Like she loves music.

She loves Fats Domino. Uh, if I put on Fats Domino, She just loves Fats Domino. I don’t know why or where that came from, but that’s her favorite. 

DJ: Great

Kevn: Yeah

DJ: You keep writing great songs, and we appreciate that very much.

Kevn: Aw, well, thank you

DJ: And listeners, the new album, Crushing Flowers, is a really, really great record. I had to go for the Coke bottle green. I’m, I’m really liking all the, uh, colored vinyl that’s coming out these days, [00:22:00] so, uh,

Kevn: Oh, absolutely. It’s fun.

DJ: Well, Kevn Kinney, thank you so much for taking the time to talk today. It’s been a lot of fun, and I really do appreciate it

Kevn: Well, thank you very much. And, and if can I make one more little side note?

DJ: Yeah, yeah, yeah

Kevn: There’s a, a compilation record that my wife has put out of Drivin N Cryin songs, um, songs that I wrote with, and Drivin N Cryin songs. It’s called Let’s Go Dancing, and it’s 100 different artists covering Drivin N Cryin songs for this bene- for four different charities.

And you can get it on, uh ... You can look for it, it’s called Let’s Go Dancing. It’s on Spotify. Let’s Go Dancing compilation, Anna Jensen art. That’s, is what it is. Or Tasty Good- it’s on Tasty Goodie Records. It’s really, it’s everybody from Peter Case to Wreckless Eric to Jason Isbell to Gang of Four to all sorts of cool people picking their, their, some songs that my wife curated, and, uh, she did a painting for everyone.

But it’s a really cool little thing. Uh, uh, there’s four albums out now, and there’s gonna be a box set [00:23:00] eventually. so just letting your listeners know that that exists, and it’s a really fun, uh, fun way to listen to, some of the songs that, uh, you’ve never heard me play before. Weird, different versions of the songs you never knew, so

DJ: No, I’m glad you mentioned it. I’ll be, I’ll be looking for that.

Kevn: Chuck Mead does a great version of this song called “Paid in Full”, but he does swear at the end, so be careful if you hear it, if, if you care about that

DJ: No problem here.

Kevn: Well, thank you for having me. I really appreciate you.

DJ: Thank you, Kevn.

Kevn: All right, my brother. Be well. I’ll see you soon.

DJ: Thanks, man.

Kevn: Is it okay [00:24:00] if, uh, some of my dogs bark intermittently?

I got my dog, Dee Dee Ramona, is laying here with me right now, so she’s…

Dee Dee Ramona, yeah.

DJ: Ramona, that’s even better.

Kevn: Sweet, sweet, sweet little Ramone.

Sweet, sweet little Ramona.