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DJ: Today I’m talking with Peter Case, who left New York in the early ’70s, headed to San Francisco and honed his craft as a street musician. He then became frontman of The Nerves, soon to become a force on the L.A. rock scene. He formed The Plimsouls, who had a huge hit with “A Million Miles Away” and since releasing his first critically acclaimed solo record, Peter has enjoyed a very successful career. Stay tuned as we talk about all of this and, his great new album My Life To Live: Peter Case At McCabe’s.

DJ: Well, Peter Case, how are you?

Peter: I’m great, man. How you doing today? Alright. I’m out here on the road, you know, and, uh, started another tour. So I’m, you know, in high hopes and high spirits, you know, pretty much, except it’s pouring rain out here and…

DJ: Oh no.

Peter: …kind of grim, but.

DJ: Well, first of all, I wanna wish you a belated happy birthday.

Peter: Thanks a lot, man. Yeah. 72, huh?

DJ: Your birthday’s five days ahead of mine, so I got one coming up too.

Peter: Is that right? Are you from 1954 too?

DJ: I am from 1958. So you’ve got just a few, not much, a few years on me.

Peter: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

DJ: All right. Well, thank you very much for taking the time to do this today.

Peter: No, you’re welcome man. My pleasure.

DJ: I think you’re from Hamburg, New York, south of Buffalo. Is that about right?

Peter: Yeah, that’s right. Right up there by Lake Erie, you know, up there, uh, Hamburg, just like right on the coast of Lake Erie, south of Buffalo. You know, it’s just about nine or 10 miles from Buffalo.

DJ: Well, I know you didn’t end up staying there and we’ll get to that, but what was life in Hamburg like when you were living there? Or more [00:01:00] specifically, what kind of music do you remember hearing while you were growing up there?

Peter: Well, you know, uh, I have two big sisters and they were, uh, ’50s rock ‘n’ rollers, you know, so, uh, they’re older. They were born in the ’40s, and so they. They took care of me a lot when I was a kid, you know, baby. And they, uh, they were constantly listening to, uh, Fats Domino and uh, Link Wray and Chuck Berry Elvis and all that, you know, all that kind of stuff in the house, you know, so we had Everly Brothers and a lot of different things like that in the house.

You know, my, my family listened to a lot of music. My mother was really into Frank Sinatra. She loved, Nat King Cole and Mahalia Jackson. And, uh, you know. But they listened to big bands. My dad liked that kind of stuff more. So there was a lot of that kind of music around. And then I had a couple uncles, I guess, I don’t know if they were cousins or uncles, I guess they’re like second cousins or something.

we called ’em uncle. And uh, but they were guitar players and they played, kind of hillbilly music really. And. You know, they played Jimmie Rodgers songs and [00:02:00] kind of bawdy, uh, honky tonk things and they would come over to the house sometimes and play guitar a little bit. And, uh, the kids would sometimes get sent out of the room ‘cause they had off color lyrics and stuff like that.

But, uh, yeah. But that was fun, you know, and, There weren’t a million guitar players back then. There were just a few, and they sort of, it was sort of a, you know, everybody back then seemed to have a hobby, you know, if you weren’t keeping bees or uh, on short wave radio, you could be playing guitar or, uh, you know, there was all sorts of different things going on, but so.

I tried different kinds of music. You know, when I was a kid, I, I learned how to play piano a little bit as a little guy, and then I just wanted to play baseball. So I, I, uh, wanted to quit playing piano, but I learned some stuff on it. And then I started playing saxophone in the school band. Uh, it was fun. I did it with my friends, you know, and that was like in, uh.

Right before The Beatles came out. And then when The Beatles came out, like I’d lost interest in saxophone, I just wanted to play guitar. I already knew about all those other ’50s guitar players, but, all of a sudden, like, I just really wanted to play guitar. And my sister was also into Joan Baez [00:03:00]and she’d come home from college with Bob Dylan and Joan Baez and stuff like that.

So, um, that’s what the, you know, back then, like before The Beatles, you know, the music you would hear, uh. It’s everything from the Kingston Trio and all those people I just mentioned that we listened to in my family. And then there was, you know, I loved records like Johnny Horton and stuff like that. Like, uh, Dion, you know, was a big favorite of mine when I was just a little kid, you know, eight or nine, eight or nine, before The Beatles and the, especially the Kingston Trio, which I thought were great.

And so, that’s what it was. You know, I grew up on all kinds of music. We had classical music in the house too, you know, So just all kinds of music really.

DJ: It sounds very similar when you talk about all the variety. It’s very, very similar to the, what I was hearing from various members of, like my parents and my family. And it’s funny, my, my Uncle Joe had some of those Oscar Brand, uh, what is it? Bawdy Songs and Backroom Ballads, which, uh, yeah, we, we discovered those even though I don’t think we were supposed to be listening to ’em.

So.

Peter: Right. I never saw their records, but I definitely saw the, [00:04:00] uh, heard these guys play ’em, you know, they, they’re, uh, Ernie Skinner and, um, uncle Paul Cotton, you know, and they would come over with these guitars and play, you know,

DJ: It’s funny. Um, well, in addition to music, I’ve heard you say that you came from a family of storytellers, which is something you became known for, where a lot of, a lot of storytellers in the family.

Peter: Well. Nobody ever really called it that, but, uh, that’s what it was. It wasn’t the storytelling lifestyle so much as, they just talked a lot and told stories about stuff that happened in the family. So my mother’s family, especially my father’s family, was a more, a little more closed, you know, verbally my mother’s family, they, uh, the Reynolds family, they were very open to, uh, people like to, uh, you know, they were.

Telling stories at the table and telling stories and at the bar and telling story. You know, always, always talking about things that had happened. And so it was an interesting, uh, way to learn about the world. And I also learned about stories because I would see the story sort of grow and mutate and so it would sort of [00:05:00] turn the heat up on certain aspects of him.

It was interesting. Certain things seemed to happen just because they were stories, you know, it was very interesting. Yeah.

DJ: Well, you were playing in rock bands, while you were in your teens, did you join existing bands or usually start your own or a little of both?

Peter: You know, I was, I started my own bands and then I joined some bands, so I, uh, I started my own band. I guess I had a band, my first one was like, when I first started writing songs was like in ’65, you know? And then, uh, I always had, that was a little after school band. And then we, we kept on playing until, by the time I was about, by about ’67 I think I was playing.

I played a few gigs. I started playing. I played at a, you know. Moose Lodge and uh, uh, Elks, you know, that kind of stuff. And then, uh, Veterans of Foreign War VFW posts. And, uh, I had bands that played at the school Youth center and, uh, things like that, you know, and we played fire halls. They used to have dances and fire falls.

So I played with groups that played for dancing, you know, rock and roll dancing. The set in ’65 and ’66, [00:06:00] you know, was beat music, you know? And soul music. And soul music. Like, you know, you had to play “Midnight Hour”, you had to play “Hold On, I’m Comin’” and, uh, there was a local song on Buffalo called “The Hump”.

You had to play that. And, uh, there was a dance that the girls did called The Hump you know, things like that. And so, “Mustang Sally” and, stuff like that. And so, we started doing that material, and I started writing songs too, and putting in some of my own interpretations of things. At one point I did an interpretation of, a Leadbelly song in one of my bands, you know, and because I, I thought that would be cool.

I was into electric music, but I was always in, as I became aware of guys like of the Country Blues people, and I guess it was Bob Dylan that led me to it, the first Bob Dylan album, which I didn’t have when it came out. The first one I got was like in ’65, but I went back and got his first album and it, turned me on to a certain way of playing guitar and folk music. That was really exciting. A way of singing it, you know? And so I got into, I pulled the strings on it, I call it, [00:07:00] you know, followed the trail, the trail back, and I got into Leadbelly and I got it was hard to find those kind of records back then, but I found Mississippi John Hurt.

And Leadbelly at the local library as well as Woody Guthrie’s, Dust Bowl Ballads. Somebody at the library over there in Hamburg was ordering like really great records and they had the Alan Lomax, Folk Songs of North America book, you know. And so, uh, all those records contributed a lot to my understanding of music and, I started trying to play like Mississippi John Hurt it took me a really long time to get that together. at all. But I started, I guess probably by ’70 was probably the first time I really started the finger picking the guitar. For real. I tried, but you know, it took me quite a long time to figure it.

So I was 16, I guess 15 or 16 when I started doing it.

DJ: Yeah, I did that a lot too. Bands and artists I liked as I started to discover. Who they were influenced by and who they liked, or who they covered. I would, I’d dig deeper and I wanted to know more about, okay. All right. If they liked them, they must be great, so,

Peter: Yeah. That’s the [00:08:00] way to do it, man. That’s the real art of like learning how to play music is, uh, following the people you love and like, not trying to be like them, but trying to see what they were trying to be like and see what they were trying to grasp. Yeah. Yeah. I get that.

DJ: Exactly. Well, what prompted you to head west and go to San Francisco during that period? Um.

Peter: Well, I don’t know. I wanted to get outta Buffalo. It was a blizzard, and I wasn’t doing so good in Buffalo. I wanted to get away. You know, I, I guess you. I thought that maybe if I just got far enough away from Buffalo, everything would work out, and it kind of did for a while. It was great to be, uh, I went west with a guitar and started playing on the street in California and it was just a period of intense freedom for me.

You know, I was, uh, it was great, you know, I was really happy during that period of, I felt liberated. You know, I could just play and go wherever I wanted to. And I didn’t pay rent anywhere and I just wandered the streets and played music and hung, followed people around and played good. And, you know, it was a lot of adventures, musical adventures mostly, but uh, you know, just a, it was a wild period and it was really great.

I was 18 when I went 

DJ: I’m always envious of that. [00:09:00] ’cause in the, uh, part of the Midwest where I grew up, I don’t remember anyone performing on the streets, but I first experienced, I first experienced seeing people busking in London when I was 19 and I down, like in the tube stations. I was, I just thought that was amazing. It was like, I’ve never seen this, this is, why don’t we do that?

So anyway.

Peter: I know. I thought it was cool too, you know? so, uh, yeah, they never did that back in Buffalo. I never saw anybody doing it in Buffalo, but out in California, we were doing it in San Francisco. Everybody was doing it, and there was a certain breed of people that were like going all around the world doing it.

So they would do it in London, and then during the summer or during the winter, they would come to California, you know, and, uh, so there were different people you would meet that had been busking all over the world, you know?

DJ: Yeah.

Peter: But I did it all. Been down the West coast, all the way from Portland, all the way down to into Mexico.

DJ: Nice. Well, I haven’t seen the entire film, but, in the documentary Night Shift by Bert Deivert, there’s footage of you playing your songs. I have seen, there’s like about a 10-minute scene I’ve seen on Vimeo [00:10:00] or whatever. Very cool.

Peter: Oh, yeah,

DJ: To see the young Peter Case, you know, kind of grainy, black and white.

Peter: There’s a lot of. Yeah, it’s weird. Yeah. Back when they made that, you know, like nobody could believe that somebody was making a film about, you’re making a film about those guys. What are you doing that for? You know? And so, so it was funny, you know, that, that, that, that it kind of preserves a, um, a time too, you know, that that was a very, you know, the way things look and the way people dressed in the streets. The way I played music, everything, you know, it was very interesting. Yeah. To me. But yeah, it’s an interesting film, even if you don’t know me. ’cause it’s just the, it’s the early ’70s and you get to look at the world so clearly through it.

DJ: Right. Well, and then you formed and fronted The Nerves in the ’70s.

Peter: Yeah, The Nerves we, we got going, uh, the real front guy, you know, me and Jack Lee and Paul Collins were The Nerves and we all kind of, fronted it. We all sang lead. But, Jack sang. Jack was kind of like the senior member in that. He, he was a little older and he’d written a, he’d written a lot of songs at that point.

[00:11:00] And, uh, so we, you know, it was a great, great period for me. I guess I, sometimes I describe my busking period as my lower education and then, uh, the period with The Nerves is like my merchant marine years, you know? ’cause we were like, you know, like, it was like an organized, it was more organized than, uh. Then the busking period.

You know, I actually lived somewhere, you know, three regular meals on a cot and then supervised activities, you know, and uh, uh, you know, rehearsals and tours and, uh, gigs. And we were really ambitious and we wanted to, uh, hit, hit it big, you know, and we tried, and the close, the closest we got was “Hanging on the Telephone” by Blondie, you know, uh, they took our song and had a big worldwide hit with it.

DJ: Right.

Peter: Yeah.

DJ: I heard that. I mean, I was, you know, in school in the ’70s, well, in high school, in the ’70s, and I can remember hearing that when it came out. And then of course, a couple years later when Blondie covered it. I guess the story is, I don’t know what the, you know, actual, but the legend has it that Debbie Harry [00:12:00] was playing a cassette of The Nerves in a, in a cab, like in Tokyo or something, and then the, and then uh, they decided, Hey, I think we’re gonna cover this song.

I think they really liked it a lot.

Peter: Yeah, they got the tape from Jeffrey Lee Pierce, who was a friend of mine

DJ: Oh, nice.

Peter: And I’d met Jeffrey Lee Pierce at Fast, a party at Fast Freddy’s house on the day of Charlie Parker’s, uh, commemorating Charlie Parker’s death. There was a party at, you know, like a drink to the death at Charlie Parker thing at, uh, and Jeffrey Lee was there, and, and I, we, we were hanging out playing guitar and then I gave him a Nerves single, so I guess he taped it and gave it to, uh, Debbie and Chris. Who took it around the world with ’em on this cassette, of a bunch of things. Jeffrey gave ‘em and they, I guess they were in a cab and like somebody reacted to it over in Europe, in Japan and they, they, they decided they were gonna cut it. So they had a big record with that. By then, the band, the band had already broken up and uh, you know, it was mind boggling at the time.

You know, that Blondie would have a hit with our song ’cause we weren’t really able to get, we were ahead of our time, I think, and. Though we were, we opened shows for The Ramones and Mink Deville and [00:13:00] everybody, Devo and Pere Ubu. We played on the road with all these people, but, it was hard to get any. Greg Shaw was into it, and he, gave us some money to cut a single and stuff, but really it was very difficult.

Now, right now the band has just signed a, a contract with Third Man Records.

DJ: Oh wow. Down in Nashville.

Peter: Yeah, and they’re putting out a record in October, a 29 song Nerves, like the total Nerves, like the complete collection of The Nerves, everything from all the recorded studio recordings, rehearsals, demos, uh, live shots that haven’t been released, and a whole bunch of other stuff. So it should be pretty interesting.

And that’s coming out, it’s called 50th Anniversary, and it’s coming out, uh, on the 50th anniversary of the EP.

DJ: That’s great. Well, by the time you started the Plimsouls, you mentioned you were already, you guys were touring. with The Nerves you were touring and opening up for a lot of bands, and then “A Million Miles Away” was huge. It was just one of several songs featured in Valley Girl. And of course the band appears, appears in the film too, which is fun.

Very fun.

Peter: Yeah. By the time that movie really came out, I think the band was, The Nerves were pretty much [00:14:00] over, or maybe just about over, but we recorded it to kind of in the middle of, uh, the peak of the Million Miles Away period. Yeah. We, Million Miles, you know, at every step. You know, I kind of changed to be in The Nerves. I took up the bass. I kind of changed my direction a bit in that I took up the bass, and I just really wanted to learn how to be in a band. You know, during the period of The Nerves, I really wasn’t doing so much of the kind of, um, solo guitar stuff that I used to do. I was just concentrating on trying to write songs and playing with a band, and I,

I’d written, been writing songs since I was a kid and I’d written a lot of songs, but like, it was a real, a real minimal style that we used in The Nerves. It was melodic and minimal, and it taught me a lot about songwriting to try to, you know, focus my writing into that band and I did it. But the band, The Nerves, you know. We were good songwriters and singers, but we ne we never had the live act that, that, uh, um, just it made me want, when The Nerves broke up, what I wanted to do was put together a band that had the same kind of songwriting drive that The Nerves had that kind of standard [00:15:00] but could blow the roof off a club. Like with a live rock and roll show. that’s what the Plimsouls, that’s what the Plimsouls became. And as I went along, I was letting more and more of my influences into the music. And so, uh, as I got to the, uh, and I would say The Nerves were really, people don’t understand the, like, people like when they hear The Nerves, they think it’s like Beatles influenced or something.

But the big influences on The Nerves really were like Bacharach. And Motown.

DJ: Yeah. Yeah.

Peter: And The Beatles. And like, we did like a real minimal version of those things, minimalistic. And then in the Plimsouls, I opened it up to. you know, kind of a more the folk rock and kind of R&B also. And so we, so the things I grew up on and loved, they were finding more of their way into it.

And the band became a very powerful and popular, you know, live act. You know, we could really hold our own and we, you know, we rocked. We, we toured all over the place and did that whole thing, but it remained kind of a regional thing. Like we were popular in California and we were popular in Texas, Atlanta, Detroit, you know, we were just starting to get going in New [00:16:00] York, but it, you know, it was just like, uh, a long process and somewhere in there, I, I’d started writing a different kind of song.

I was really getting, like, as I said, the processes started where I was letting more of what I loved into what I did. And I just sort of had this vision that I wanted, that I was gonna, uh, do what I do now, which is the song, you know, as a songwriter. Just really pursue that. And I think a lot of that vision was from the people I saw when I was really young.

I wanted to take what I’d learned from the Plimsouls and The Nerves and apply it to. That kind of solo performance thing that I’d seen, Lightnin’ Hopkins and, uh, John Hammond Jr. And Arlo and, uh, you know, I’d seen a lot of solo folk performers when I was a kid. And so I knew, I definitely, I loved John Fahey and I loved, uh,

DJ: Yeah, me too.

Peter: music that was just like, you know. In touch with its roots, but also really in touch with its heart and that you could play. I don’t know, I was just, it was just the kind of communication that, that maybe I didn’t feel like I was doing anymore with the Plimsouls. I lost interest in that kind of, in [00:17:00]making it big in rock and roll, I guess.

And, I was in rock bands for 10 years, you know, and then by the end of it, I was sitting there like returning really To this real centered kind of place where I would write the songs and sing them and play ’em on the guitar and, and put ’em across in a very, you know, I don’t know what to say.

But yeah, that’s where, that’s where I was going. You know.

DJ: Right.

Peter: I was inspired by it. It was kind of a vision really. And, and I guess it led to, like, I was one of the, you know, first people that I, I think maybe I was the first person to do that because, From the rock band world. ’cause I would go into radio stations and play live on the radio and the people couldn’t believe I was doing it, you know?

It was kind of mind boggling to them that I would come in just with a guitar and, and do it. And, you know, my folk music stuff, it’s always, it’s got a lot of the, The Nerves kind of thing in it. Melodic and the rhythms and everything. A lot of ’em are. They’re based on guitar playing, but they’re based on like a, a kind of, orchestration that you can do with a guitar or like where you can play like the bass and the, you know, like going back to Mance Lipscomb or something like the, where the bass or, or Mississippi John Hurt, where the [00:18:00] whole thing is contained inside the guitar.

Like the whole orchestra, like the guitar is a band, you know. And, uh, and that’s, that’s what I’ve always tried to do. And as I grew up in it, I learned how to do it better and better, you know?

Peter: Hi, this is Peter Case, and you’re listening [00:25:00] to with DJ Fey.

DJ: Well, in the ’80s, I guess the late ’80s, you released, , your great. Self-titled Solo album produced by T-Bone Burnett, T-Bone, also co-wrote some of the songs with you, and that that record featured an incredible lineup of musicians Jim Keltner, Roger McGuinn, Van Dyke Parks. 

Peter: Van Dyke. Yeah, it was great playing with Van Dyke T-Bone, that’s who I wanted to work with, and I said Van Dyke. Roger, you know, we had the idea of cutting one of, uh, Shane McGowan’s songs with, 

uh, with, uh, van Dyke and Roger McGuinn, kind of like, 5D they cut with Van Dyke and Roger McGuinn. So our, our vision of that was to sort of, you know, do that, you know, take a, take a, Folk Rock it, you know, which we did. And it’s a beautiful, uh, it was great to play with Roger. He had just like the greatest guitar part on that song. It was so beautiful. And there was a lot of people [00:19:00] on there, Jerry Scheff and, uh, Fred Tackett, uh, from, uh, Little Feat plays on there. And, you know, it was a great experience making that record.

Campbell’s on there, Mike Campbell from Tom Petty.

DJ: Yeah. Yeah.

Peter: It was exciting record to make. And then it’s also just got some of my really completely solo stuff, like I’m talking about like “Walking in the Woods”, you know, and “Small Town Spree” and stuff like that.

DJ: Right. I saw T-Bone years ago. I’m trying to remember now what year it would’ve been, and he, it was at the Wiltern in L.A. but it was Sam Phillips who he was with, I guess at the time. She opened for Elvis Costello. And, uh, so T-Bone was part of her band and then he was also part of Elvis Costello’s band that night.

It was a great, great show.

Peter: Oh yeah.

DJ: So.

Peter: Oh, cool. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I remember when T-Bone was doing that. Yeah, that’s like around the early ’90s.

DJ: That would’ve been right. That’s right. Well, since that first solo record, you’ve released a lot of great albums over the years. I, I love that you’ve been consistently putting out great stuff there. There really wasn’t any long [00:20:00] stretch of time when you weren’t writing and performing. It seemed like there were albums coming out pretty often.

It was just great.

Peter: Pretty regularly. Yeah, every couple, three years. You know, for a while there I was doing ‘em every two years and now it’s like a little more spaced out, but I’m always on the road. I’m always doing something. So there’s a lot of, a lot of different projects and stuff that I’ve been doing, you know? And when I didn’t do a Plimsouls thing, I also did put out a plum.

I mean, when I didn’t do a solo thing, I also did a Plimsouls record in the. ‘90s, you know, that I like. Yeah. So there’s just been a lot of work. I try to just keep working, you know, I just like, you know, creating the music, you know, it’s, uh, what I do.

DJ: I loved HWY 62, uh, very bluesy and cool. I listen to that one in my car a lot, so…

Peter: Yeah, I think that’s one of the best ones. I, I really like that one a lot too. Yeah. I play a lot of those songs still live and, uh. that was a great experience recording that and writing it and everything. Yeah, I, I’m, I’m, uh, I’m fond of that one. my best one, you know, I like that one a lot. I like this new one.

My favorite one is the new [00:21:00] one. ’cause it’s like just what I do live and with me and the audience and, and I get to, uh, you know, Len Fico from the record company wanted to. Put out a live album. It was his idea, like, ’cause he saw me at McCabe’s. He said, well, let’s go back to McCabe’s. You do a live album and I’ll put put you on, and we’ll have a lot of the talk too.

I’m really okay. Whatever. You know. So they, we’ll do a two record set, he said, so I said, all right, let’s do it.

DJ: It’s very fun. It’s, it’s great. It’s a great

Peter: Yeah. I’m proud of that record. Yeah. Cool, man. Yeah, because I’m proud of that one and I, I like the music on it. And the thing, you know, done, recorded over two nights.

Then we had to cut it down to like the two albums.

DJ: Well, the new album, My Life to Live: Peter Case at McCabe’s comes out April 24th. I was fortunate to hear it in advance of the release, and it’s really, really nice , and very fun. Like I said earlier, you’re a great storyteller and the, the album is really, it’s a fun album to listen to and a lot of great tracks on it and, just fun to hear, you know, the audience, you know, responding and it’s a, it’s really great.

Peter: Cool. Thanks. [00:22:00] You know, I’m proud of this record, man.

DJ: And I love McCabe’s. Whenever I’m out in LA I always make it a point to try and hit the shop, so.

Peter: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love, I love McCabe’s. It’s just sort of my musical home, you know? Uh, it was where I played my first solo show after the Plimsouls in January ’84, I think it was. And, and, uh, uh, ever since then I’ve played there. They’d say I’ve probably played there more than anybody else, but it’s, it really is kind of my musical home.

you know, I’ve got a lot of musical homes now, but that’s a place that like, where it all kind of began for me as a, solo performer, It’s always great going in there. And it sounds good in there and there’s a great vibe. I’ve seen a lot of great musicians in there.

Like I say on the record, it’s an inspiring place, you know, where I’ve seen everybody from Townes Van Zandt to Memphis Slim, you know, it’s a place I, I was really happy to record.

DJ: Yeah, well a lot happening with you with the album coming out and you’ve been doing a lot of live performances, uh, this month and next, I think you’re playing one back in Buffalo, I think.

Peter: Yeah, I’ll be back in Buffalo, uh, in a couple weeks. I’ve been playing all, I, I’ve been touring a lot, you know, starting in October I did [00:23:00] a, a tour. We did a two-part tour in Europe. So in October, November we did, uh, Spain, November, you know, Spain, Italy, and uh, a And then, uh, just a few weeks ago, I got back from doing a, three week tour of England and, uh, Sweden and the low countries over there.

So we had a, so the European, that was like a whole European tour that went on for quite a while there and now. And so right before that I was touring the States. So now I’m touring the States again. So I’m pretty much staying on the road as much as possible. My theory is sort of like, you know, keep working while I can, you know, I feel good and, and the music’s sounding good, so I just keep going with it.

DJ: Well, Peter Case, you’re great and this has been a lot of fun. I thank you for this.

Peter: Alright, David, thanks a lot man. I appreciate your interest and, and your, your show man. So, keep me posted and, you know, good luck with everything man.

DJ: All right. Safe travels, right.

Peter: Alright. Alright man.

Yeah, Good talking to you

DJ: Thanks. Thanks, Peter.

Peter: Later on, man. Bye.